Poll

are you likely to be interested in this type of site?

yes
32 (94.1%)
no
2 (5.9%)

Total Members Voted: 34

Voting closed: February 03, 2005, 10:21:53 pm

Author Topic: Possible Diabolo trick search engine...  (Read 8676 times)

lemony

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« on: February 03, 2005, 10:21:53 pm »
Ok, in another thread there was some discussion of whether it would be possible to create a sort of tricks search engine. See here:

http://www.diabolo.ca/forum/index.php?topic=320

so i knocked up a quick hi-res prototype so people could see what i was suggesting. it lives at http://www.lemony.co.uk/trickSearch and i have to add that i've borrowed some info and an animation off diabolotricks.com... i'm sorry about that and all content will be original or posted with consent in the real version

bear in mind that it doesn't actually work at the moment, all you'll get are static pages... so what i'm really looking for are any comments on what functionality you'd like to see, different information you'd like to see displayed, and ideally whether anyone is willing to help write the information...

also note (for seán_) all ratings/scores would be based on votes so if you disagree with them then you can change them.
The diabolo wiki please contribute in any way you can.

Sean

  • Administrator
  • Thanks: 241
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2005, 10:33:57 pm »
Maybe it would be worthwhile to see if you could integrate that sort of interface with Jim's diabolotricks.com site? It would save having to reinvent the wheel and would add a wortwhile functionality to an already popular site.

It could be combined with diabolotricks.com on the same site or perhaps develop a partnership with diabolotricks.com in which the trick pages link to the relevent trick on diabolotricks.com and your pages develops into a sort of wiki format where people can add their ideas on learning the trick, on variations, and difficulty.

Just an idea. Maybe see if Jim has any thoughts.

lemony

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2005, 10:40:13 pm »
that would be excellent i agree, i was hoping for some feedback before i approached him though...

i did aim to accept user submissions for the site and also allow the editing of existing page to  some degree... however short of writing my own wiki engine (which is not fun, i've tried before) to thespecifications of the site i think the editing should be fairly tightly controlled...

also, i administer one based on mediawiki and it's been vandalised on a number of occasions
The diabolo wiki please contribute in any way you can.

Arjan

  • Moderator
  • Thanks: 69
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2005, 10:41:37 pm »
I think diabolotricks is a complete site with lots of tricks. Not all newest things are on it, but it`s impossible to keep up with that. There for I don`t think it`s very usefull to make a trick searcher.
It would be a lot work also. On this forum is a trick index thing, and on the net are lots of sites full with tricks and variations, why would you make such a complicated thing?

Punkerpanda

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #4 on: February 03, 2005, 10:43:22 pm »
i like both of you guys's ideas. the whole search engine thing is wonderful, even though it might be tricky cause some tricks dont have names, and some have different names. trapeze, stop overs ie. or inverse trapeze and magic knot.

but i think that's what the advanced search is for.  great idea, love how it is so far.

nezzybaby

  • Thanks: 1
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2005, 12:18:09 am »
If anyone knows how they should open a wikidiabolo.com

for those that don't know wikipedia.com is a web encyclopedia which anyone can add or alter data in.

they contain disambiguation pages, so you could search for stopover and find trapeze. In a diabolo one anybody could add tricks and you could easily link to related tricks for more information. For example if the trick called for a backwrap you could link to backwrap and find out how to do one.

I think this would be the most useful way to do it, and providing there was some moderation can be the most accurate.

just a thought, have no idea how to do it myself, but have seen quite a few wiki<insert subject topic here> pages

nezzybaby

  • Thanks: 1
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2005, 12:20:41 am »
Someone must be able to do this, all diabolists are engineers!

im basing this on myself and the MFP http://www.artofdiabolo.com/team.php

lemony

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2005, 12:28:25 am »
as i said, i've administered a wiki for a fair old while now... i could set up a new one simply enough if enough people seemed willing to contribute to it
The diabolo wiki please contribute in any way you can.

seán_

  • Moderator
  • Thanks: 49
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #8 on: February 04, 2005, 01:44:29 am »
not forgetting
http://diabolo.ca/forum/index.php?topic=170&highlight=wiki

edit: I like the idea of seeing if Jim would be prepared for your idea to be integrated into his site, for several reasons including preventing duplication.

also on a small point, you have the animations after the instructions, I think having them before the instructions might be better so you have an idea what the trick looks like before reading how to do it.

zzzzzzzzzzzz

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2005, 08:49:05 am »
As Arjan and Martijn might know i'm planning to build a new diabolo website. (the idea is to build it in dutch so you guys wont profit much of it)

My plan was to build a website with several static pages about diabolo in general and a complicated trick database.

for every trick (wich can be easily added by administrators/moderators) i will record some info..

- name
- category (suns, orbits etc)
- difficulty (visitors on the website will be able to vote for its difficulty level, in this way i want to tackle the fact that tricks arent of the same difficulty level for everyone)
- animation (like the diabolotricks.com gif's)
- video (both arjan and martijn said they ware willing to record video's of tricks for me...
- description/explanation will describe how you can do the trick and what you should be aware of.
- sugestions for other related tricks

because all info (except the animation and video) will be stored in a database it will be easy to build a search engine to find the tricks.

I agree that it will be a hell of a lot work to set this up and insert all the tricks.... And then it should me kept up to date...

The problem is that i dont have much time :S.. so the site will not be done soon... but i think it would be a rather nice site when its complete...

diabololi

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2005, 09:20:11 am »
I think it would be kinda nice to have it like this (part of it)


               miss---L hand Wrap----etc
                 ¦
         SPRINKLER--------DOUBLE SPRINKLER--------TRIPLE SPRINKLER
                 ¦\                                 ¦                                   ¦              
                 ¦  \------------------------------------------unwrap/suicide
              Sun   \
                         unwrap/suicide\
                                                 \
                                                   \
                                                     Shuffle etc

I dont know much about websites, but I'm guessing you have some sort of databasey thing. So basically if you click on sprinkler, it would come up with info about the trick and all the tricks you can do from it (sun, double sprinkler, unwrap, suicide miss etc). I guess thats kinda like whats already there!

Oli

Eduardo

  • Thanks: 1
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2005, 01:12:04 pm »
Quote from: nezzybaby
Someone must be able to do this, all diabolists are engineers!

im basing this on myself and the MFP http://www.artofdiabolo.com/team.php


Hehehe I'm an IT Engineer too :P
And I think all the people that are willing to develop a new diabolo website should join together and develop only one, joining forces and ideas, I know most people do not have time to develop this alone, so a few programmers doing it together would end it faster and better...
And I'm even willing to help (if its going to be made in php :P)
The idea is nice, and I think users should be able to add tricks, not only moderators and admins, else it is not going to stay up to date...
Or users could submit the trick, and a moderator would aprove it (and possibly correct speeching errors and such...)

Eduardo

Martijn

  • Moderator
  • Thanks: 113
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2005, 01:23:42 pm »
Quote from: Arjan
I think diabolotricks is a complete site with lots of tricks. Not all newest things are on it, but it`s impossible to keep up with that. There for I don`t think it`s very usefull to make a trick searcher.
It would be a lot work also. On this forum is a trick index thing, and on the net are lots of sites full with tricks and variations, why would you make such a complicated thing?

I agree. (again, Arjan :mrgreen: )
I don't need such a trick search engine. I watch some videos now and then, but don't visit this kinds of sites. Maybe others like the idea, but I would say it's almost impossible to make this, and keep it up to date! :?
download Made in Taiwan at www.arjangroenendijk.nl

Tom_G

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2005, 06:14:21 pm »
I think the advanced search option is the key point to this. As I said before, it would be great for combos to be able to find different tricks that start and end exactly where you want them to - for example, if you searched for a trick from a left backwrap to open string, it would come up with a single fritz release, double fritz release, cross arm toss, etc.  The other points are just extensions of the layout of www.diabolotricks.com .

Great idea - if Jim agrees it would be even better. I also like the idea of the style rating :)
It takes 24 muscles to smile, 42 to frown, and only 4 to hit someone in the face. Luckily for you, I need the exercise.

Rusty

  • Thanks: 2
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2005, 06:39:23 pm »
I think this is a great idea, program a site in maybe php and use something like MySQL to store the tricks. You should be able to upload video, description with links for other sites that explain the tricks. As said before, if everybody would be able to upload tricks it would be a lot more up to date, with a lot more tricks. I would love to help programming, even though I am studying electronics not IT. But if it is alot of tricks it will take up some space.

Rusty, Norway

Andy

  • Thanks: 6
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #15 on: February 05, 2005, 11:50:15 am »
what wuold be good is if the engine could have a "create random combo" function or something like that which could pick a list of tricks that connect and display them. IT would test your skills quite nicely i think. anyway, its just an idea

lemony

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #16 on: February 05, 2005, 04:13:08 pm »
Ok, well it seems that for now what people would like most is a wiki... so i'll set one up now, once that's done i'll get in touch with Jim about hooking up to make the search engine which i'll stick up alongside the wiki at some point in the future... that sound like a plan?
The diabolo wiki please contribute in any way you can.

lemony

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #17 on: February 05, 2005, 05:10:34 pm »
The wiki is set up and editable, apologies for the fact that i havn't actually added any content yet but i've got coursework to do and rugby to watch...

http://diabolo.lemony.co.uk/wiki

Please contribute anything you can to it, I'm sure you all know more than me about the diabolo anyway...

Also, i thought i thought i'd leave it up to you guys to think of a better logo than i could come have up with, it will replace the flower logo on the front page and so needs to be 135x135px, post your ideas here or message them to me

cheers!
sam
The diabolo wiki please contribute in any way you can.

Punkerpanda

  • Thanks: 0
hmmm?
« Reply #18 on: March 09, 2005, 02:05:18 am »
I was walking to my friend about a program to make a diabolo routine with. i remember this, but it seems it either is being worked on secretly or has become inactive.

i was wondering if there are any news on it? if not, my friend is very good with computers and said he would write a program similiar to that, where you could also make a routine easier(move around tricks, aproximate time per trick/routine, and a trick search engine as discuseed above)

he could make a database that opens in excel so people can share and add tricks, and categorize them.

the only problem is, his diabolo lingo is bad(when we worked out ar outine once he wrote down a trick as swingy thingy, or something like that) nobody would understand what he means, except him. so, he would need a database of all the tricks, with different names, etc.

i always struggle to write down routines in a good fasion, or to even think of one, so i think a program like this would help alot.

in his opinion this might take him 2-5 hours max to write.

-viktor

Spooned

  • Thanks: 1
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #19 on: March 09, 2005, 07:25:49 pm »
Loving the idea as i have been contemplating it for quite a while. Since i can "implement" HTML (i do it at school, sometimes) i could help with the layout, but the problems would start to arise with the actual serching (unless you can do it in php or MySql which i dont know how to use); unless you could implement some kind of query if the database was in excel or access but then the problem would be displaying them online. So the only way i can think of is to give each trick a dedicated page and add it to the "MetaContent" tag, then create a small program to look up each one. The only problem with this theory is the huge amounts of space (let alone time) it would take to achieve  :( , i also think that it would be amazing if it was to happen though. If anyone else knows what i mean or is interested and wants to give it a go post your ideas. Ill make a working version when i have time between cousrework and school.  :P
Diabolo or Diablo

nezzybaby

  • Thanks: 1
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #20 on: March 11, 2005, 01:56:10 pm »
^ that sounds long, setting up databases on websits doesnt need to be such a stressful task, most web design packages will hae built in features to generate and search databases, never do more tha you haveto in programming. Besides if everyone just uses the wiki that is already set up wellbe fine.

we dont eed another database, we just eed to startfilling the one we already have.

this computer has the worlds stickiest keyboard, sorry for all the missing letters in my posts today

kragen

  • Thanks: 2
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #21 on: March 13, 2005, 11:43:09 am »
nah the searching would be easy enough - just use another pre-constructed search algorithm to search the HTLM pages for keywords.

That page looks like an amazing idea - so often now im looking for info on a certain trick (double duocide, genocide etc...) and find nothing, (nobi's site is good for some video's, diabolotricks.com can be good but doesnt have a lot of the more advanced tricks).
Justin
Gravity Vomit - Gravity pulls down, we throw up.

Mat

  • Thanks: 0
Possible Diabolo trick search engine...
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2005, 10:50:45 pm »
The wiki sounds like a great idea  :)
I'm new to diaboloing though, so I don't really have much to add yet :(
:idea: Would it be easy to make a more advanced search thing in php for the wiki database? Tricks could be categorised as simple or hard or whatever and you could select which difficulties you want to search.