3 diabolo shuffle: help! (wrap start & asynch shuffle)

[Sean]

Hey Fred - this one's directed at you!  

My 3 diabolo wrap start is solid now, I can even get the shuffle to last for up to 25 diabolos over the top... but only in a synch style. I've been working hard at it for almost 6 months. I can start with an asynch style for maybe one full rotation but then I slip into synch style (or drop everything ). I want to learn asynch 3 diabolos so badly because it seems to open up so many 3 diabolo tricks, but I just can't get my body do move like it has to for the asynch shuffle!

I know to concentrate on the left hand (for us righties) and to concentrate on lowering it quickly, but combining this with the right hand (again, for us righties) with 3 diabolos just doesn't work for me. It's too awkward. I've been stuck with no progress now for 2.5 months.

I've watched that first clip you put up with a 3 diabolo asynch shuffle so many times - it looks so simple!! Hope you can help - it's very cool to have you checking in on this forum!  

(Oh, and I think your 1 up 2 diabolo sun trick at the end of your last video ranks among the best diabolo tricks ever recorded!)

Sean

[-Fred-]

Hello!

I know to concentrate on the left hand (for us righties)

Yes, it's important because when you run 2 diabs, you've not the habit to use this hand.

...to concentrate on lowering it quickly

It's better to run it a long time because it's less exhausting.

So, it's hard to explain.
When i run my 3 asynch diabolo shuffle, i try to slow down my movement. To do it, i throw my diabs more straight up with my arm (not with my wrist). With the other hand (the one who recieve the diabs), i try to give the opposite movement to my arm. As this, my 3 diabolos suffle is less flat and run more slowly.

I've been stuck with no progress now for 2.5 months.

Good luck, it won't last....

I don't know if i answer to your question .

@+

--- Fred ---

ps: look here:  3d-slow.avi
(I use Xvid codec)

[norbi]

I hoped you wouldnt mind Fred, but alot of people cant view the .avi's on your site, so i got the 2nd montage converted and uploaded it to mine. For anyone interested...
http://www.norbithejuggler.co.uk/2nd-montage-fred.mpg

hope thats ok Fred. Oh by the way, yes the 1up 2diab sun is probably the best thing on film at the moment, when you going to try 1up 2diab suicide?

[-Fred-]

There's no problems for the video .
For the 1 up 2 diabs suicide, not yet (a suicide is to slow and the 1 up as to be very hight). It's able with a sun and maybe with other 2 diabs fasts tricks (i search... ).

@+

--- Fred ---

[Sean]

Fred,

Thanks for the words of encouragement. Sometimes we need those with 3 diabolos... it's just so discouraging!

I tried slowing it down yesterday and managed to change the pattern a bit. If I try and send the diabolo up higher with my left (your right) hand they end up going far off to the right side (your left) and missing the string.   This has always been a problem for me. Could I be lifting my hand too late in the pattern?

You said you use your arm to send the diabolos up. In your slow video (which I missed the first time I read it - thanks for showing me that! ) it looks like you use your right wrist (my left) a lot. Is your wrist doing something different to the diabolos?

Also, if you were to stop moving your left stick (my right) would the pattern continue the same but without speeding up the diabolos? Could I concentrate on only moving my left (your right) hand at first and then add the other hand later?

I have so many questions... this has been driving me nuts for so long!  

Sean

[Sean]

Thanks to your advice to try and make the pattern as big and slow as possible, I managed to get 15 catches with a big slow asynch pattern!  

The pattern is *very* big though right now. The diabolos go a bit above my head. I assume the pattern will get smaller with time?

I also tend to have problems with the diabolos going in front or behind the string right now. I expect a few 100 hours of more practice will solve that.

Sean

[Sean]

Hey Fred and Priam - this one's at you guys:

So I'm getting at least 12 throws every time now with the asynch shuffle. I've got up to 25 throws a couple times and I've managed to go from 3 low to 3 high a few times. Finally some progress!

Two new questions:

1. How long can you guys keep the asynch pattern going without whipping? (the slow diabolo always dies and falls off, is this a matter of changing my hand motion?)

2. How long did it take you before you learned 3 diabolo whipping?

Sean

[Tahia]

i'm not sure but i believe that fred and priam don't whiping for the moment cause theyhaven't learnt it

[norbi]

Well then i'm sure Priam could ask Baptiste.

[-Fred-]

Sometimes i could whip a diabolo but i have not a precise movement (i have to work it more).

I can run my diabs during more than 1 min without whipping (in general, i drop it because i miss a trick).

--- Fred ---

[Tahia]

sure you always miss a trick in 3 diabolo !!

[Elmeri]

Mod edit: moved here because it seemed like a good place for it

I have some big problems with my 3D suffle. I can´t keep it up. Every time I get all 3 on string, maybe get 1-3 rounds, it falls/ collides.

Can somebody give some help, like arm movements or stuff like that? Or is it just like practice, practice, practice.... I just got some idea how to start.

Thank you in advance.

Elmeri

[Arjan]

Hello Elmeri, welcome to the forum!

There are several topic`s about 3 diabolo, and serveral movies. I still have the same problem with my 3 diabolo, but that doesn`t matter.

http://diabolo.ca/forum/index.php?topic=133

Look at this one, it`s a tutorial for the a-synch shuffle, including tricks.

http://diabolo.ca/forum/index.php?topic=122

This has lot`s of way to good skills of the mysterie guy Quentin

http://diabolo.ca/forum/index.php?topic=93

This is a video of Sean (administrator) who recently discoverd his 3  diabolo skills.

Those are all a-synch shuffles. For synch shuffles check out Thrash, Ludovitch, Tony or Diabolumberto and many more.

So wich one do you want to learn? depends on you, while thinking, I guess a mod will replace this topic, wouldn`t they?


EDIT: Elmeri, I`m total not an expert at 3 diabolo, but it looks like you tend to go into the a-synch shuffle with three. I saw you video from your website. Maybe an expert will pay a look at this?
But those styles linked above are the right ones.

[Sean]

Thanks for summing up all those articles, Arjan! Elmeri, I had a look at your video frame by frame. First of all, congratulations on learning the wrap start - that's not easy! In that video the pattern falls apart because you don't lift the diabolo that was wrapped when it makes it to the left of the string. You in fact do the opposite. You pull your left hand back and cause that diabolo to fall into the pattern. Whether you are going to learn synch or asynch... you will have to lift the diabolos with your left hand. Concentrate 100% on your left hand at first. Concentrate on lifting those diabolos high and making a high slow pattern. You'd suprised just how high and slow you can make it - especially if you are doing asynch. When I first got it it was a couple feet above my head.

I'd say looking at where you are now you'll get it soon. I can almost guarantee you that if you work at it hard and systematically you will have it within three months from now... probably sooner.

I have a small video of my three low asynch pattern recently here as well: http://diabolo.ca/video/temp/sean_3d_dec2and3_2004.mpg

Study lots of videos of other people, study videos of yourself, and practice smart... you'll get it soon!

Sean

[Elmeri]

Guys, guys don´t look that video, at my site. It´s very very bad. I can do better that was filmed last summer. And in couple of weeks now I´ve allmost learned wrap start, last summer everything (with 3) sucked, even more.

[wes]

Hi Fred, how are you? I'm happy to meet you in this forum!
I'm working on keeping 3diabs on the string since you adviced me.
And now I keep it for about 1 minute rarely.
Have you done 531 with 3diabs(low) ? In your 2nd montage video, tha last trick is 531?

I can keep 3diabs without wrapping for 30 to 40 seconds now.
When I try to wrap, other two diabolos crash...

I have a question to everyone.
Is my 3diabs synch type, or asynch type?
http://www37.tok2.com/home/wataru/movie/juggling/diabolo/3diabolos/3diabs_0412042.mov
I still don't know the difference between asynch type and synch.

[Sean]

Is my 3diabs synch type, or asynch type?...
I still don't know the difference between asynch type and synch.

Have a look at these messages where some people described the difference between synch and asynch.

Your 3 diabolos are asynch. With asynch the pattern is slower and it's easier to do tricks... but the diabolos don't speed up very much (for some people not at all) so it is hard to keep the pattern going for a long time.

Congrats on the success with the 3 diabolos! I have exactly the same problem when I try to whip - that's going to take a LONG time to learn!

Sean

[Baptiste]

Hi everybody   .
This message is my first message on this forum. I'm sure this forum is a very very good thing for diabolo.
About the speed of the diabolo during the 3 low :
In a pattern with 1, 2 or 3 diabolos, whatever it is, the speed of the diabolos always tends to a constant speed which is lower with an 3 async pattern than in a 3 sync pattern, but this speed is not null so you can theoriquelly keep the 3 async pattern as long as you want but you have to correct diabolo more often than in a 3 sync pattern.
For me the wrap acceleration is now totally natural, I don't have to think about it to d it : I always do a wrap acceleration one turn after the start (on the last diabolo). But to work on the wrap, you have to throw the diabolo following the one you want to wrap a little bit higher. Then the wrap will be very easy and very usefull tu give some speed or to corect the diabolos.
Don't discourage you, the 3 shuffle is a good way to test your patience and everybody finally have it if you work hard and smartly.
Goodby

[Sean]

Wow - it's great to have the inventor (and master) of 3 diabolo asynch himself giving advice!! Welcome!

I think 3 diabolos low has been one of the greatest tests of patience I've ever had.

When I watch videos of you whipping 3 diabolos do I see it correctly that your whip causes the diabolo that is on the string to jump and that your left hand stops moving as it normally does for one diabolo? I mean, does your left hand stop lifting diabolos at the same time you whip?

Do you think it will ever be possible to whip every diabolo in a 3 diabolo shuffle? Can you do this yet?

Sean

[norbi]

Do you think it will ever be possible to whip every diabolo in a 3 diabolo shuffle?

Yes i am reasonably aware that i'm not Baptiste, but i thought i'd answer anyway..... Yes.