Author Topic: Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations  (Read 38483 times)

JGherkin

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« on: February 21, 2005, 11:45:28 pm »
Sorry the Vortex tutorial took a bit longer than I expected...what can I say....I'm lazy  :lol:  but finally it's all done! Fairly large file (33mb), sorry about that but I hope all who want to see it can cope with it. Check out my site for it or the direct link here.  Remember to right-click and choose save as...erm, for all you mpeg lovers im gonna have to ask for some kind soul to take this and convert it for you, I'd be happy to host if you can send it to me although it may be simpler for whoever does it to temporarily host it  :)

O and Dave, I found a bit of time while my cameraman was setting up to try the S-Fan trick a few times, I managed to land a quick one, nowhere near the slow controlled version we had been thinkin of...not yet anyway, it will happen  :wink:

(edit) ooh and one more thing, if anybody's interested I do have a video of my performance...I realise afterwards it was fairly ambicious...and I had aimed at the wrong kinda of audience...and I had planned for a different kind of venue...and from the point of view of the video the lighting wasn't fantastic...but yeah, if anyones interested I'll see what I can do about making the video easier to watch and put it up for your pleasure.

Juggling.tv - Vortex tutorial

Sean

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2005, 12:52:16 am »
Great tutorial, John. It seems like just yesterday you were asking me on MSN for help on the s-fan and you were keen to learn stuff from the Man's Chew video. Now look at you... it brings tears to my eyes. :)

Mr. Tripod has filmed many of my videos too... he's got a really steady hand doesn't he.

In terms of the MPEG, here's an idea: why don't you read this handy little tutorial and try making it yourself with TMPGEnc. ;) Just export your video in uncompressed AVI and have a go. The quality you'll get using the original AVI will be much better than anything one of us can create from your compressed WMV. You'll want to set your frame size to 352x288 probably.

seán_

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2005, 12:52:48 am »
Awesome video John, very usefull, something for everyone in it.

It took me a while to catch the difference between a short and a long vortex (note how I dodged having to use the plural :) ).
The long version reminded me about something when I first learnt to vortex. I had real problems getting the backwrap on to get back to the regular shuffle so I used to let the diabolos go into a reverse shuffle giving me time to get the backwrap on.

Any tips to go with particular tricks John (or anybody) I'm particularly thinking of the suicide and the arm stall versions.

thanks

Seán

Arjan

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2005, 07:56:05 am »
Pretty much learn all of em!

JGherkin

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2005, 08:01:44 am »
Ahh yes I remember the days of watchin mans chew and sitting there literally like this  :shock:  no joke.  Nearly learnt all the tricks in it, I will catch up  :P

I'll get to work on the mpeg then when I get back from college today.

I'll just give you guys a few notes that may help out with the tricks a lil better than just the video:

Seeing the difference between the basic short and long vortexi (nice dodge sean_ :lol: )seems to be one of the hardest things to do when learning them.  What really pointed out to me the difference was when I was really pleased with finally getting to grips with the suicide vortex which uses a long vortex as the entrance. I was asked to show someone how to do it because he knew the vortex but I never did manage to explain to him it uses a long one and not a short one, I just got an odd look  :lol:   I first learnt the long vortex but after watching JiBes Fan Combo a few more time thought "I'm doing this so wrong" and changed to the short vortex...then saw Mans Chew and thought "I'm doing this so wrong...hang on a second!"

On the suicide I think the thing that really helped me nail this was realising when you come to the end of the long vortex, the diabolo that goes to sit nicely in a wrap has to be moving much faster horizontally and be aimed higher, this gives it more air time as you release the stick and thus more time to catch it, the better you get the less vertical movement you could give it thus giving you a faster suicide lending yourself to a faster, tighter style.  Depends what you like doing.

The Arm stall takes a little while to get the right movement on the wrap, instead of having a strong wrap giving your diabolo horizontal motion to the left, you need to pull it higher and to the right allowing you to get your arm underneath the string in between.  From there just experiemtn with dropping the stick with different amounts of force to get it around before popping your hand out, grapping the stick and doing a vortex.

Ok, hope thats helped make things a little clearer or if I've confused you, just forget you ever read it, the important thing about these is to learn them one at a time and get it clear in your head whats going on otherwise it's just gonna be messy lol.  Guess I'd better run and catch my bus (its snowing! woooooooo!)

barnesy

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #5 on: February 22, 2005, 10:00:33 am »
Good stuff, thanks!  The difference between a short and long vortex hadn't occurred to me either, but I see it now.   I'll need to study it in more detail once an mpg version is available as I'm now having trouble playing it [video formats rant edited out :wink: ].

diabololi

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2005, 01:38:13 pm »
Wehey, lovely tutorial! I can do continuous short vortexi now  :) .
Oli

Moe

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2005, 11:26:41 pm »
Very nice! I didn't even know what a vortex was before I saw this vid, but now I can even do 'em myself. I love the trick already :P Thank you for a very good tutorial!

Martijn

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2005, 09:36:27 am »
It's a great tutorial! Well done :D

Only... I still can't do the vortex :cry: I can't send the left diabolo (for righties) around the other... If I try, the left diabolo falls of, and the right one gets unwrapped. help?!
download Made in Taiwan at www.arjangroenendijk.nl

Rusty

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2005, 12:11:36 pm »
Really nice tutorial, lots of variations and very easy to see and understand what to do.

I will sure start to work on my vortex when I can use my left arm again

Rusty, Norway

Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #10 on: February 24, 2005, 12:51:47 am »
I think I'm having the same problems as Martijn.   When I throw the frontwrapped diabolo, the other one doesn't come up and circle it.

Julian

barnesy

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #11 on: February 24, 2005, 09:32:31 am »
I'm not totally sure that I understand you problem, Martijn, but I had a lot of trouble learning the vortex until I started paying attention to the unwrapped diabolo.  

Before then, I would drop the left diabolo when I moved the wrapped one to the left hand side.  I knew that I had to lift the wrap over the left hand diabolo, but I just couldn't get the trick.  I sorted the problem out by watching the unwrapped diabolo, and making sure that it was always in a little V of string.  It was as simple as that!  Once I spotted that that was the problem, I could do vortexes reliably.  

I'm hoping it'll be the same for you!

Martijn

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #12 on: February 24, 2005, 11:50:04 am »
Thanks a lot Barnesy! Finally some progress! Instead of losing my left diabolo, it becomes a tangled up mess now :P But that's just about hitting the string again when sending the left diab around the other.. I'll practise it more within a few days.. now I'm a bit ill, having a bad cold :(

Cheers m8!
download Made in Taiwan at www.arjangroenendijk.nl

barnesy

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2005, 12:08:02 pm »
Cool, that's good to hear.  Yes, all you need to do now is let the diabolo pass in front of the string and you'll be there!

I can sympathise with you being ill - I've only just got over the same sort of thing myself.  There's a lot of it about!

Elmeri

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2005, 01:01:21 pm »
One fun combination (I found to day) is:
long vortex-> (dont change direction but do the back warp)
bw knotsteal->
ac-fan->
vortex suicide.

So, do long vortex, when you back warp rigthside diabolo (rigthies) pop the left diabolo over the rigth one do a bw knotsteal (late-back-warp-open), do a front warp then fan and end it to a vortex suicide.

Martijn

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2005, 07:32:46 pm »
YEAH! I can do the Vortex finally :D Thanks to everybody (Arjan, Sean, Wes, JGherkin, Barnesy..) Everyone who tried to explain it to me :P

I finally got the movement with my lefthand when trying to do a vortex after a frontwrap suicide (I watched a movie of Sean). I prefer to do it that way.

WOOHOO!! 8)

(sorry for this post, but I'm just so happy :wink: )
download Made in Taiwan at www.arjangroenendijk.nl

Sean

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #16 on: February 24, 2005, 08:09:00 pm »
That's cool Martijn. :D It's unbelievable the world of tricks that open up when you master the vortex.

For me the key to getting the vortex solid was realizing that it's mostly a left hand motion (for right handers) and not a right hand motion as it's easy to believe at first. In fact, you can do the vortex entirely with your left hand if you want once you've put a wrap on the top diabolo with your right hand.

So, try concentrating on circling your left hand diabolo around. Don't think about pushing the top diabolo over with your right hand - just stopping the diabolo from it's normal direction with the wrap is enough right hand motion.

Martijn

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2005, 08:44:38 pm »
I always knew that the left hand motion is very important, but when I right fronwrapped the diab, I get confused and stuff.. It's easier if you're already in the good direction (by a frontwrap suicide for example) to realise what you have to do with your lefthand.

Can't w8 to learn some wicked variations! :D
download Made in Taiwan at www.arjangroenendijk.nl

seán_

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #18 on: February 24, 2005, 10:22:07 pm »
Quote from: Elmeri
bw knotsteal (late-back-warp-open),


That would be this then?

sounds like a great combo!

JGherkin

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Vortex tutorial : Base trick and advanced variations
« Reply #19 on: February 24, 2005, 10:49:55 pm »
(I'm gonna switch all my movements to how a right hander would do it to make this easier to understand  :) ) I feel differently about the left hand motion being most important, for me this is incredibly subtle and its incredibly easy to do the trick with just the right hand wrap.  To show this I was doin two diabs with a mate whos only just picked diab up so no chance of knowing how to do two.  He held the left stick, I the right and we pulled off a vortex, I told him to keep the stick as still as possible.

Having said that...it is important in making the trick look smooth and feel effortless...I just felt I might point out this feel can be different for others. Hey, maybe its a left handed thing?  :wink:

And sorry I still haven't sorted out n mpeg version if anyones awaiting that, I'll try n get round to it before the end of this weekend, promise  :oops: