Author Topic: The life-cycle of a Forum  (Read 25806 times)

norbi

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The life-cycle of a Forum
« on: January 06, 2007, 07:55:39 PM »
Ok, so among some of the 'elders' there has been talk of the direction of this forum... And how we can improve it.  Unfortunately it almost seems doomed...

You see, although VOTW are 1 small way to keep a forum interesting (and even they are becoming fewer and weaker) what really needs to happen is people THINKING.
Don't just post anything for the sake of boredom. 
Think about new ideas, technique and the like, in the world of diabolo, then post about it... but FIRST, do your homework... has this trick already been invented (there are tons of sites out there to which you can not only look on, but should have already checked out really [and if you haven't, quit wasting time posting here, and go solidify your foundations]), has the question already been asked a BAZILLION times, AND most importantly of all.. does anyone care? As in, does anyone needs to know you are bored?

There is only a limited amount of information, technique, etc... which can be said/shared.  Once that is all said, there is little chance of revival.

The forum starts up and everyone shares a whole load of useful information and people ask new questions and everything is great. 
As soon as everything is said, 1 of 2 things can heppen next...
1. the clever people search and find their answers already so don't need to post.
OR, and much more noticeable
2. the dumb people post the same questions again, and clutter up the forum by annoying everyone with their instantness. 
Unfortunately both of these happen at the same time. Then everything goes sh*tty all the important people lose interest, the kids take over.
With the sudden overload of complete w*nk, the attention is diverted elsewhere and a new forum is created... and so the cycle continues.

Just a thought.

Beni

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2007, 08:23:19 PM »
Unfortunately, leaving a forum open to anyone will be asking for spam. Still, there's nothing much you can do about this apart from applying really strict rules. Still, this forum is doing supprisingly well. There are threads continued from two years ago on first pages. Maybe making more stickies, especially in the 'I'm New' section would help. More stickies answering more questions. But these are only the humbles thoughts of a reletavely new member to the forum.

OLOBAID

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2007, 09:14:08 PM »
maybe its possible to give the ability to post only after passing a little examination about the posting etiquette...

i know i would just scrape through... ;)
this idea seems a bit cheesy... hmm, but on a second thought, could work!

--- watch Videos on YouTube, visit my Website or mail to hiwatt@gmx.at ---

seán_

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2007, 09:36:08 PM »
I was wondering about that OLBADOID but i dont think its workable.

Forums will go through cycles, sometimes there will be lots of things to interest you at others it will be dead. There is a problem when new people come along who are unaware of the way a comunity has been run. We seem to be in one of those situations now.


As a mod I'd be interested in getting peoples thoughts on how to improve matters.

Some things that have been brought up by users via pm's and msn etc.
If posters are annoying people why have hardly anybody started to use the 'ignore' function?
Should obvioulsly pointless posts be deleted/locked?
Should we start banning persitant annoying posters?
Should we set an age limit? (what limit)
Do certain sub forums (off topic, I'm new) leave the way open for annoying posts
Should the forum tend towards the more elite and punt nebies of towards diabolotricks like in the early days?
Should it be all inclusive?
Should the law of the jungle exist, members allowed to flame and make it obvious when somebody is unwelcome?

Thoughts?

Susannah

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2007, 10:10:44 PM »
I think that using the ignore function would possibly just get confusing as bits would be missing from threads. That's why I haven't been using it at any rate.
There are definitely some posts that should be got rid of, some of them are completely pointless, plus it might make people think a bit before making another post if previous ones are deleted.
Some of these newer members should take a look at how regularly other people post. I'm sure there are plenty of other people like me who frequent this forum but rarely post as it isn't necessary.
There would be no way of implementing an age limit although it does seem an appealing idea right now, and having said that there are some younger members who do take note of posting etiquette, so it would be unfair.
I would have said that just letting them know how to behave was the way forward, but it doesn't seem to be getting through does it? I think it may have come to the point where making it apparent when someone isn't welcome is the only thing for it.

Mark BMC

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2007, 10:20:17 PM »
Some interesting points raised. I do agree with Susannah, and try to only post when i have somthing of value [hopefully] to add to a thread.

Striking the balance between having a forum that is friendly and promotes a growing world diabolo community from grass roots to 3d yet still maintaining a high level of content is always going to be hard to achieve.

A few ideas

I do think the quick deletion of a pointless new thread avoids spaming up the bord and also pointless lambasting of somebody just because they haven’t done their homework.

Maybe a standard pm that could be sent to a forum member that is maybe overposting or spaming?

As im not forum software savi would it be possible or is it already for posts in these bord not to come up on recent posts unless you specify at a particular time e.g. if Im feeling particularly helpful.

I think I do put my vote into the anti flame camp, I do know of quite a few cool older  diabolists who have already been put off this forum by the idea that if they were to post they would get torched by somebody who isn’t even shaving [ not to promote ageism but in terms of not taking things to seriously and being respectful.]

I would also like to say that I do think theirs still plenty of life in the old forum yet from somebody joining the forum and posting a great new vid like introducing flow to people saying how much they enjoyed meeting me  ;)

I think a few changes to quickly and politely remove spam will keep the content high and the forum fit and healthy with a glossy coat

yours hungoverly mark bmc

fredo

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2007, 10:59:20 PM »
Mark BMC is definitely right. Deleting pointless topics is the single possibilty to avoid a big mess of various threads oof one and the same topic. Just locking them will cause justmore mess. Maybe giving such users (those who open a new fan-thread e.g.) individual help, i.e. just sending them the links to convenient topics or the advice touse the search function. This would be a lot of work for mods. Or just letting the users post the links an delete the post after a few days (which is definitely not that good, as it still doesn't avoid users to post out of lazyness, as they get their information anyway.) Just be strict and delete the stupid posts. PM is the best way to go imo.

The forum has come to this point. You're totally right norbi.

OLOBAID

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #7 on: January 06, 2007, 11:23:49 PM »
i totally agree Susannah! i dont think the ignore function is the right way, unless you really cant stand somebody. but why should this happen here!

i also agree with BMC that topics should be deleted easily if they contain not many posts! when the moderators control whats going to be deleted there wont be the individual mess you have when starting to ignore spammers!

gathering information is a high art!
i think diabolo.ca should break the circle and go on. there is so much diaboloknowledge in it which must not be abandoned! when it gets to FAT maybe enlighten the load is the best way!

i think to giving the people the ability to post from the start away is probably a magnet for spammers - in the im new section this is ok but for the rest...
the people will always take the easiest way and if its easier to ask than to search its logically! the more spam there is, the harder it will be to search! its kind of a vicious circle!

maybe D.ca should take a little fee for paying the moderators work!

--- watch Videos on YouTube, visit my Website or mail to hiwatt@gmx.at ---

martijn

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #8 on: January 06, 2007, 11:28:12 PM »
Nice post Norbi, I think it's good to finally start the discussion about the issue, hear other's opinions, ideas and suggestions, and come to a solution where everybody will be satisfied with.

I think the "Ignore" function is not used often, because it is quite confusing. And come on, it is not really a solution to the problem. Covering your eyes and hoping the problem will go away is not the way to go ;)

I also agree with deleting pointless stuff right away (I also think it's a good idea to get rid of the Offtopic forum, since it's obivously stimulating spam, and it's not really being used for offtopic juggling talk... or anything really interesting/related to diabolo). The I'm new section also stimulates garbage. Very basic questions that have been covered before (to death), which can be found very easily in the stickies or with the search function, as long as you're prepared to put in a little time, effort and thinking.

If a certain member doesn't listen to the moderator's or member's *hints* and PM's, about the rules of basic Netiquette, I think a (temporary) ban should be well in place. Polite suggestions sometimes just don't come through, unfortunately.

Setting an age limit (15yrs?) might be a useful solution, but then again how are you going to control that? And it's pretty superficial, since there are also young children who do know how to properly use a forum.

norbi

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #9 on: January 06, 2007, 11:32:20 PM »
How about we issue AFBOs (Annoying Forum Behaviour Orders)?
K, lame joke aside..
Something like:
Strike 1 - intopic warning, and polite PM
Strike 2 - post deletion, and serious PM
Strike 3 - ban!

It would (should) certainly get people thinking a bit more before they go posting mindless drivel.


OLOBAID

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #10 on: January 06, 2007, 11:44:57 PM »

Strike 1 - intopic warning, and polite PM
Strike 2 - post deletion, and serious PM
Strike 3 - ban!

It would (should) certainly get people thinking a bit more before they go posting mindless drivel.
i thought this is already the procedure... why not?

--- watch Videos on YouTube, visit my Website or mail to hiwatt@gmx.at ---

norbi

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2007, 12:16:38 AM »
If it is the case, then what the wtf is allsoppy still doing here?


Graham

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2007, 12:56:12 AM »
I think that removal of spam threads is the way forward, and the procedure norbi proposes works well but may be a bit harsh. I think one problem is there's not always a mod there to spot these sorts of problems before the thread gets established (at which point a mod might hesitate to delete it, even if there's a perfectly good thread on the topic already). One way to enforce it better would be if any user could click a button to "flag" a post and alert the mods to whatever it is, be it spam, a pointless bump of a 2 year old thread (this happened earlier) or whatever, and then the mods could take a look at it. I don't know if it's possible to implement that though.

phunky

seán_

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2007, 01:00:21 AM »
                                                                                                                                          /|\
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Tom Derrick

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2007, 01:06:10 AM »
How about an incubation period for new members? The first few days they can't post at all, possibly receive a short automated PM explaining why they can't post straight away, and some basic guidelines. For a week or so after that, a post limit might be handy to keep the self-elected ignorent from spamming up the board too much, and perhaps a ban on starting new topics. After the incubation period (provided that they show themselves as at least a slightly competent forumite), then they would be free to post however they want.

Anyway, just a suggestion, plus I don't know how easy it'd be to implement it all. Does it sound like a reasonable idea?

martijn

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2007, 01:18:45 AM »
One way to enforce it better would be if any user could click a button to "flag" a post and alert the mods to whatever it is, be it spam, a pointless bump of a 2 year old thread (this happened earlier) or whatever, and then the mods could take a look at it. I don't know if it's possible to implement that though.

Like sean_ tried to say...? (you're pointing at the Quote button for me) I think we already have this function. Underneath every message in the right bottom corner, you will find: "Report to moderator". As far as I know, it's never been used, but it might be a good way to flag threads.

Graham

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2007, 01:29:22 AM »
Aah, I was wondering what that arrow meant. I didn't think to look for that feature first before suggesting it...  :-\
Anyway, in that case, since it's already implemented, all that needs to be done is to encourage people to use it!

Susannah

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2007, 01:35:12 AM »
Erm......yeah that would be the case if it worked, but I just did a little test and it doesn't. Nothing seems to have happened so maybe that needs looking into.

martijn

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2007, 01:40:20 AM »
Susannah, I got a generated e-mail in my inbox that you flagged the post... so I think it worked.

Susannah

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Re: The life-cycle of a Forum
« Reply #19 on: January 07, 2007, 01:44:16 AM »
Ah well shows what I know...I thought it would let all moderators know or something. Sorry  :-[

 

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