Author Topic: Tricks that add spin  (Read 11295 times)

Chiok

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Tricks that add spin
« on: February 02, 2005, 12:07:43 AM »
There wasn't a topic on this that I could find, but thought it could be useful in the formation of combos and such.

What I'm interested in knowing, is what tricks can be incorporated into a long string of tricks that would add spin to the diabolo so that you don't have to break up the routine by chinese whipping or orbital thrusts to keep it going.

A list of moves that I know increase speed when done:
1) Infinate Suicides - you can use these to start it spinning as was pointed out in the said topic by Sean, séan and others and also acclerate it by pulling longer on the upstroke.

2) Arm / Leg / Body / pet hamster orbits - just like the thrusts without the wrap and the foundation of the 2D shuffle that keeps it going.  If you have dirty string, works very well fairly quickly, but don't even try wrapping the diabolo less you want a face of it.

3) S-fan - during a 2D routine, this can add spin if done in the same direction as the spin of the diabolo so it can continue for as long as they stay in line.  I'm not able to get one diabolo on the darkside one personally, can only do the C-fan which just slows things down.

Are there any other tricks people know of (1, 2 or 3D) that can add speed without disrupting the rhythm of tricks so you can make it all flow like the remenants of a bad curry.

Also any moves that really slow a diabolo down that should be avoided for any great length of time (like grinding) would be useful as well.  Hopefully this will aid others in linking tricks together successfully.

(The MFP did something like this at the WJF I believe, I'd like to hear what they had to say too.)

Chiok
www.gravityvomit.co.uk - Gravity pulls down, we throw up.
University of Bath Juggling and Circus Skills

Sean

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2005, 02:00:46 AM »
Yes, it's an interesting topic.

We discussed some of this in a thread about Yufi's one diabolo style (and video):
http://diabolo.ca/forum/index.php?topic=115

...and that thread about Eric and Antonin's WJF workshop is here:
http://diabolo.ca/forum/index.php?topic=214

Quote from: xfirebladex
Arm / Leg / Body / pet hamster orbits

Hamster orbits :shock:  have you been watching a certain video of mine too much recently? haha

Quote from: xfirebladex
S-fan - during a 2D routine, this can add spin if done in the same direction as the spin of the diabolo so it can continue for as long as they stay in line.  I'm not able to get one diabolo on the darkside one personally, can only do the C-fan which just slows things down.

For me, although the s-fan generates enough speed to keep 2 diabolos from falling off the string, it doesn't do much more than that. I suppose it can be useful for going from almost no spin to a bit of spin (like that hand throw into s-fan trick). You can keep them going forever, but they'll never go very fast.

Then again, with time we will probably discover a more effective s-fan motion. It's still a relatively new trick.

I assume you mean AC-fan (anti-clockwise) not C-fan (clockwise). Confusing, I know, because S refers to the shape of the string. Whether you are doing an AC-fan or C-fan (and regardless of which side you do it on) one diabolo will speed up and the other will slow down (assuming your  hand motion is even). Interestingly, I find you can minimize this slowdown effect by changing the hand motion (making it smaller...) whereas with an s-fan the opposite effect is the goal (hand motion must therefore be different - larger). So, having a good AC or C fan motion will kill an s-fan and having a good s-fan motion will kill an AC or C fan.

Sean

Chiok

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2005, 02:49:38 PM »
I must confess my fan technique is lacking somewhat.  Though I do agree that small hand movements are necessary to reduce the rate of slowing, and conversely for the S-fan.  

Though something I've noticed when doing one handed suns swinging it around the leg and such, is that the harder and faster you do the sun, the quicker the diabolo slows down.  If you do the motion in a fairly slow and controlled manner, then you still have spin left over.  When I was learning these, I used to fling it around for that lil extra pernash, but it lost all spin and just twisted up the string.  To do with the force of the axle due to the magic of physics (which aren't really interesting enough to comment on).

The same should apply with a regular Fan, by keeping the hands close together and moving firmly but not quickly, you should be able to keep it going longer.  I shall try this and time it soon.

Though when I watched your trick of the week with the finger grind to s-fan and magic triangle out, when the diabolo was thrown from your hand, it was quite wobbly with lack of spin, but once in the s-fan seemed to sort itself out quite nicely.  So the fan should do something for speed.

More thoughts please!

Chiok
www.gravityvomit.co.uk - Gravity pulls down, we throw up.
University of Bath Juggling and Circus Skills

martijn

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2005, 06:14:13 PM »
Great topic! :D

Another trick which speeds up a diabolo:

1) suicide -> slowcide (or infinite slowcides), if you pull the right stick a bit, when slowciding the left stick, it keeps spinning. It's a lovely trick :)

Arjan

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2005, 11:39:28 PM »
Quote from: Martijn
Great topic! :D

Another trick which speeds up a diabolo:

1) suicide -> slowcide (or infinite slowcides), if you pull the right stick a bit, when slowciding the left stick, it keeps spinning. It's a lovely trick :)


Yes, and has lots of variations! ;)

Arjan

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2005, 07:13:57 AM »
This works a little bit for me... but don`t go try to pull a slowcide genocide after that when your diabolo is spinning slowly, because the diabolo could get hit by the string and will tilt, or the stick doens`t fly up high enough to catch it again. But it is a nice thing to do, doesn`t require a lot speed, I believe Antonin indeed can start a diabolo by just doing this combo.

Tom Derrick

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2005, 05:48:32 PM »
Quote from: Sean
I assume you mean AC-fan (anti-clockwise) not C-fan (clockwise). Confusing, I know, because S refers to the shape of the string.


I'm a little confused. What's the difference between these fans?

seán_

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2005, 06:06:45 PM »
Quote from: Tom Derrick
Quote from: Sean
I assume you mean AC-fan (anti-clockwise) not C-fan (clockwise). Confusing, I know, because S refers to the shape of the string.


I'm a little confused. What's the difference between these fans?


This is covered in the various fan threads, especially this one where you can see how it confuses evreybody at some point :)

Jay1981

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Chinese Whip for a beginner... any tips?
« Reply #8 on: March 14, 2006, 02:01:31 PM »
I'm an absolute beginner to diabolo (in fact, I started only 2 days ago).
I had a go on my mates and decided the same day that this was something I wanted to learn to do well, so I bought myself a Mr Babache Harlequin the same day.

Now I think I've cracked whipping the diabolo, but Chinese snaps and whips are both evading me at the moment (and a multitude of other speed building tricks, but I thought I'd start here hehe :) ). I just end up in a tangled mess. :?

Any tips?
Arm orbits used to be a problem... now they're a way of life!!

-Leo-

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #9 on: March 14, 2006, 02:31:51 PM »
Try using a left handed wrap to do the whips in as it is easier to keep the diabolo steady-assuming you right handed. Also bring the diabolo about 1/4-1/3 of the way along your string.

Welcome to the forum!

Leo
Behind your back is your front.

Jay1981

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2006, 10:06:36 AM »
Quote from: guppygould
Try using a left handed wrap to do the whips in as it is easier to keep the diabolo steady-assuming you right handed. Also bring the diabolo about 1/4-1/3 of the way along your string.

Welcome to the forum!

Leo


Okay... I'm doing a left hand wrap. I'm waiting for the diabolo to travel near to my right dominant (whipping) hand. I try to whip the diabolo up, but it just seems to stay beneath my right stick, or twist up.
Am I doing something wrong?  :?
Arm orbits used to be a problem... now they're a way of life!!

Chiok

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2006, 12:49:02 PM »
A degree of tension is required when whipping (I'm assuming up and down whipping, it gets confusing when people mention different names).  I personally use a right hand wrap over the cup nearest to you, but a left hand wrap is usable as well.  The diabolo also needs to have a certain amount of spin before you can start whipping or the shocks will just stop it.

You want to keep the string fairly taut when you pull up, and then relax a little when you snap back down, you just need to make sure you hand is travelling in the opposite direction to the diabolo.

Ideally, a video of your technique would speak volumes.

Chiok
www.gravityvomit.co.uk - Gravity pulls down, we throw up.
University of Bath Juggling and Circus Skills

Jay1981

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2006, 02:58:16 PM »
Quote from: Chiok
A degree of tension is required when whipping (I'm assuming up and down whipping, it gets confusing when people mention different names).  I personally use a right hand wrap over the cup nearest to you, but a left hand wrap is usable as well.  The diabolo also needs to have a certain amount of spin before you can start whipping or the shocks will just stop it.

You want to keep the string fairly taut when you pull up, and then relax a little when you snap back down, you just need to make sure you hand is travelling in the opposite direction to the diabolo.

Ideally, a video of your technique would speak volumes.

Chiok


I can't provide a video of my technique, as I don't have a camcorder/webcam. A video of your technique would be helpful though, or a point in the right direction to a site which shows you slowed down/training videos of chinese whips/snaps.
Arm orbits used to be a problem... now they're a way of life!!

martijn

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Tricks that add spin
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2006, 03:21:58 PM »
Quote from: Jay1981
A video of your technique would be helpful though, or a point in the right direction to a site which shows you slowed down/training videos of chinese whips/snaps.

At your service! :)

www.circusplanet.net/diabolo/video/1d/orbitacceleration.mpg
www.circusplanet.net/diabolo/video/1d/chineseacceleration.mpg

I hope the videos are clear, and can help you a bit, let me know!

 

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